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+---- Thread: Driveshaft prices are dropping (/thread-887.html)
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RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Grumpy Goat - 04-08-2023
(04-08-2023, 12:59 AM)Bikepirate Wrote: Hi Grumpy - been a while since I visited this site - apologies!
I haven't heard of problems with the RS driveshaft, can you give me further information? Is it a mileage problem?
Welcome back.
Officially - as in "from BMW Motorrad" - there is no problem, per se, with the driveshaft on the RS (or the GS) or any other water-cooled boxer. That does not mean that there is not a problem out in the field.
Several owners have experienced failures of the driveshaft universal joint (yoke) while the driveshaft is under load, i.e. when the bike is being ridden. These catastrophic failures often then cause the shaft to whip around inside the shaft housing / single-sided swingarm until the bike is brought to a standstill. By then other components would have been damaged, including, in one case I have heard, damage to the transmission. I have not heard of any accident / loss of life secondarily caused by the failure of the driveshaft leaving the rider in a dangerous situation on the road.
Many people have also reported rusting of splines at one or both ends of the cardan driveshaft which is - to my mind - a separate and unrelated issue to the one above, and is not a problem to the same extent. In my opinion it is a maintenance issue and not a material issue which I suspect the yoke failures to be.
BMW Motorrad has attempted to address the latter issue - the rusting splines - via a service bulletin (not a recall) in which some owners of newer model GSs and RTs are advised to bring their bikes in for inspection and potential fitting of a small one-way "duck-bill" drain valve on the underside of the swingarm at the lowest point. This allegedly to help drain any water or condensed moisture from the swingarm thereby allegedly mitigating the rust at the splines. I have my doubts as to the efficacy of this valve but it is what it is. During that inspection, I have read that in some cases, driveshafts have been replaced leading one to wonder ....
Point is, they are silent on any other issue regarding the driveshaft. Also worth mentioning, owners of bikes of similar model and year where the yoke failures have occurred have not been included in these service advisories regarding the inspection and fitting of the drain valve. It is almost as if they concur that these are separate and unrelated issues.
All the while, and as far as I am aware, BMW Motorrad does not specify that there is any need for periodic inspection or servicing of the driveshaft since the driveshaft itself is not a serviceable part, i.e. the universal joints are not re-greasable.
So, in summary, depending on who you listen to, the potential "problem" is either material failure of the cardan shaft itself or rusty splines. As I said before the latter is - to me - not a "problem" but is a maintenance issue that someone should be doing, and in my case that someone is me.
As for the failures of the yokes on the cardan shaft, it is not a problem unless it happens to you or to a "significant number" of people. How significant is significant? If it happens to 20 people is it significant? If it happens to one person who has well maintained his bike per the manufacturer's recommendation only at the dealer, and if this failure happens in the middle of an intersection where he can't get out of the way of oncoming traffic and he is killed - is that significant?
Then, mysteriously, a new driveshaft (part number change only??) has appeared in the fiche for our bikes and for 80% cheaper than the previous part.
Sorry for the long-winded response, but to me this is a problem that could happen to anyone one of the thousands of RSs (and GSs and ...) with a similar designed cardan shaft. The only way to mitigate the risk is by periodic inspection which I (and a few others) choose to do. For more on that I invite you to visit my Youtube channel and watch the videos of my experience on this issue. They are in the RS Maintenance playlist, starting with this one:
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Bikepirate - 04-09-2023
(04-08-2023, 06:42 AM)Grumpy Goat Wrote:(04-08-2023, 12:59 AM)Bikepirate Wrote: Hi Grumpy - been a while since I visited this site - apologies!
I haven't heard of problems with the RS driveshaft, can you give me further information? Is it a mileage problem?
Welcome back.
Officially - as in "from BMW Motorrad" - there is no problem, per se, with the driveshaft on the RS (or the GS) or any other water-cooled boxer. That does not mean that there is not a problem out in the field. ...
Many thanks for the reply. Looked at your vlog - most informative! As I live in a very temperate climate and rarely venture in the rain, I think I'll let this inspection go
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - sanemancured - 04-10-2023
I posted this on the other RS forum.
My friends bike, UK, 106,000 miles.
The rear wheel is attached by the top arm only.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Grumpy Goat - 04-10-2023
(04-09-2023, 07:17 PM)Bikepirate Wrote: Many thanks for the reply. Looked at your vlog - most informative! As I live in a very temperate climate and rarely venture in the rain, I think I'll let this inspection go
When it comes to rust on the splines issue, it does not have to have lots of liquid in there to have rust. They say that condensation is more often than not the cause of the moisture-causing rust. This means that unless one lives in an arid climate there is a likelihood of condensation and hence some rusting will occur. Regular servicing of the shaft and re-lubrication would keep this rust at bay.
The frequent shaft inspection, more importantly, would allow inspection of the universal joints which is my main concern.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Grumpy Goat - 04-10-2023
(04-10-2023, 02:56 AM)sanemancured Wrote: I posted this on the other RS forum.
My friends bike, UK, 106,000 miles.
The rear wheel is attached by the top arm only.
Yes I saw that and that appeared to me to be yet another example of a universal joint letting go and the whipping around destroying other components that it came in contact with. If that was not bad enough, the potential for leaving the rider / bike without any power in the path of oncoming danger is even more catastrophic.
What is your friend going to do about the bike? I would think that with 106k miles the bike is not new and the cosyt of repair may be such that it is better to write it off, which is sad.
The thing with this issue is that it is not predictable in its occurrence.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Bikepirate - 04-11-2023
Now you've got me worried.....
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Motorhead1977 - 04-11-2023
(04-11-2023, 12:08 AM)Bikepirate Wrote: Now you've got me worried.....
While I have the BMW extended warranty into 2026 my concern is that BMW will try and deny coverage. After all they're in the business of selling plans and not actually paying out for repairs. I'm on the edge of whether to buy a spare prop shaft just in case since the price isn't prohibitive. What to do, what to do???
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Motorhead1977 - 10-01-2023
Interesting, I just looked at ASCycles fiche for the prop shaft for my '20 1250RS and it calls for the old part number with a price of $733.22! No indication of any superceding part number.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Grumpy Goat - 10-01-2023
(10-01-2023, 04:39 AM)Motorhead1977 Wrote: Interesting, I just looked at ASCycles fiche for the prop shaft for my '20 1250RS and it calls for the old part number with a price of $733.22! No indication of any superceding part number.
This sounds like what I observed and documented in post #1 of this thread. I suspect that the fiche for the bikes is not being updated to point to the newer shaft. However, the links in my post still work (even the one saying $732.22) and the one to the BMW site still shows that the one supersedes the other.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Motorhead1977 - 10-01-2023
Yet, I just checked MAX parts fiche and it shows that the old prop shaft number is NLA and to use the updated number at the $210.19 price. Hmmmm
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - darrell - 10-01-2023
(10-01-2023, 06:10 AM)Motorhead1977 Wrote: Yet, I just checked MAX parts fiche and it shows that the old prop shaft number is NLA and to use the updated number at the $210.19 price. Hmmmm
Order from your dealer so as probably get a 10 - 15% discount and and then send the receipt to the MOA for another 10% and you have a $170 drive shaft on your garage parts shelf. If you never use eventually someone will need one and you can sell it to them.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - Motorhead1977 - 10-01-2023
(10-01-2023, 07:35 AM)darrell Wrote:Planning on just that when they reopen on Tuesday morning.(10-01-2023, 06:10 AM)Motorhead1977 Wrote: Yet, I just checked MAX parts fiche and it shows that the old prop shaft number is NLA and to use the updated number at the $210.19 price. Hmmmm
Order from your dealer so as probably get a 10 - 15% discount and and then send the receipt to the MOA for another 10% and you have a $170 drive shaft on your garage parts shelf. If you never use eventually someone will need one and you can sell it to them.
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - 36654 - 10-03-2023
(04-10-2023, 02:56 AM)sanemancured Wrote: I posted this on the other RS forum.
My friends bike, UK, 106,000 miles.
The rear wheel is attached by the top arm only.
Did your friend take pictures of the failed drive shaft?
RE: Driveshaft prices are dropping - 36654 - 10-03-2023
(04-07-2023, 01:08 PM)Grumpy Goat Wrote:(04-07-2023, 12:31 PM)mspratz Wrote: ... The space between the large diameter (~2 inches) casing of the front half and the smaller diameter (~1 inch) shaft of the rear half is filled with a high density rubber-like compound. I can't remember whether the same is true of the original.
Hmmmm ... I will say that I never looked closely at this area in either shaft.
(04-07-2023, 12:31 PM)mspratz Wrote: Given the history of my current (original) driveshaft, I intend to swap it out for this new one sometime soon.
Looking forward to your feedback on that. I will likely not replace mine even at the next 12k spline service, unless needed.
Has anyone checked the old-style driveshaft for the torsional isolation material?