Hello all

I’m trying to source one of the above to check the cam timing on my lovely 2015 RS and here in the UK it’s a struggle to get a hold of one. 

Brad, known as Boxflyer on the SportTouring forum won’t post one of his home made products to the UK because he’s been mucked around by customers in the past. 

If anyone is willing to purchase one on my behalf and send it to the UK I’ll pay up front of course. 

My bike is great. 40,00 miles in and it’s a keeper. It’s always been a little vibey higher up the rev range and I’d like the peace of mind checking the timing would give. 

Peter

(04-08-2023, 11:39 PM)sanemancured Wrote: Hello all

I’m trying to source one of the above to check the cam timing on my lovely 2015 RS and here in the UK it’s a struggle to get a hold of one. 

Brad, known as Boxflyer on the SportTouring forum won’t post one of his home made products to the UK because he’s been mucked around by customers in the past. 

If anyone is willing to purchase one on my behalf and send it to the UK I’ll pay up front of course. 

My bike is great. 40,00 miles in and it’s a keeper. It’s always been a little vibey higher up the rev range and I’d like the peace of mind checking the timing would give. 

Peter

Peter, How much is it and do you have a link to the buy page?

(04-08-2023, 11:39 PM)sanemancured Wrote: Hello all

I’m trying to source one of the above to check the cam timing on my lovely 2015 RS and here in the UK it’s a struggle to get a hold of one. 

Brad, known as Boxflyer on the SportTouring forum won’t post one of his home made products to the UK because he’s been mucked around by customers in the past. 

If anyone is willing to purchase one on my behalf and send it to the UK I’ll pay up front of course. 

My bike is great. 40,00 miles in and it’s a keeper. It’s always been a little vibey higher up the rev range and I’d like the peace of mind checking the timing would give. 

Peter

If you're talking about the device that supposedly puts the correct operating tension on the cam chain so you can verify that the cam timing is correct (possibly using the BMW camshaft locating device 11 0 827), I wouldn't bother. I have the BMW locating device and was thinking about buying or making the tensioner device you are considering. I decided to try an experiment. 
First, I left the regular cam chain tensioner in place, and tried the locating device on the camshafts. It fit in place (indicating "correct" timing with limited tension). I then removed the cam chain tensioner and carefully used an appropriately sized metal rod to manually tension the cam chain to varying degrees. I found that no amount of increased tension, beyond enough to take the slack out of the cam chain, made any difference to whether the locating device would easily fit in place. 
In other words, if you check the timing with the regular cam chain tensioner in place, it will be correct. I guess the fact that BMW specifying the expensive cam chain tensioning tool for checking the timing is just normal German perfectionism.

(04-09-2023, 08:18 AM)mspratz Wrote: If you're talking about the device that supposedly puts the correct operating tension on the cam chain so you can verify that the cam timing is correct (possibly using the BMW camshaft locating device 11 0 827), I wouldn't bother. I have the BMW locating device and was thinking about buying or making the tensioner device you are considering. I decided to try an experiment. 
First, I left the regular cam chain tensioner in place, and tried the locating device on the camshafts. It fit in place (indicating "correct" timing with limited tension). I then removed the cam chain tensioner and carefully used an appropriately sized metal rod to manually tension the cam chain to varying degrees. I found that no amount of increased tension, beyond enough to take the slack out of the cam chain, made any difference to whether the locating device would easily fit in place. 
In other words, if you check the timing with the regular cam chain tensioner in place, it will be correct. I guess the fact that BMW specifying the expensive cam chain tensioning tool for checking the timing is just normal German perfectionism.

That's interesting. I've read 2 details, including one from Boxflyer himself where using the tool to pre tension the chain fully has made a difference.

From memory in one case the locating device didn't fit until the pre tension was applied and in the other it did until the tension was added.

I was thinking of trying what you did and manually adding various amounts of force to the tensioner. I can't really see BMW designing and manufacturing a tool that seems relatively complex if there is no need?

I've managed to reserve one with the BMW Club UK. I'll report back

Peter

(04-09-2023, 07:54 AM)Grumpy Goat Wrote: Peter, How much is it and do you have a link to the buy page?

Wayne, I don’t know the price although I think it is reasonable. It was $20 a while ago I believe. Brad (Boxflyer) is contactable via the SportTouring forum. 

Peter

(04-09-2023, 11:39 PM)sanemancured Wrote: Wayne, I don’t know the price although I think it is reasonable. It was $20 a while ago I believe. Brad (Boxflyer) is contactable via the SportTouring forum. 

That sounds reasonable and I was thinking that I could buy it for you if I had a link to some sort of website where he had it on offer. Sounds like he might be selling these things directly on a small scale and not via any sort of website. I will have a look in that forum when I have some time, which seems to be kinda short these days.

(04-10-2023, 07:12 AM)Grumpy Goat Wrote:

(04-09-2023, 11:39 PM)sanemancured Wrote: Wayne, I don’t know the price although I think it is reasonable. It was $20 a while ago I believe. Brad (Boxflyer) is contactable via the SportTouring forum. 

That sounds reasonable and I was thinking that I could buy it for you if I had a link to some sort of website where he had it on offer. Sounds like he might be selling these things directly on a small scale and not via any sort of website. I will have a look in that forum when I have some time, which seems to be kinda short these days.

Thank you GG

(04-12-2023, 07:27 AM)sanemancured Wrote: Thank you GG

I just left him a message in the Comments Section of his "BMW R1200/1250 DIY Cam Chain Tensioner Update" video. Seems he has no contact information other than contacting him via his username on the BMWSportTouring forum, and that forum does not appear to have search functionality (I suppose unless one joins). I am not intending to be a member of the forum, as I already am a member of enough forums and have no time for another.

I've just checked the cam timing on my 40,000 mile 2015 1200. I borrowed all the tools required from the BMW Club UK.

Both sides were out. The go/no go gauge is a very good fit and it wouldn't even try to go onto both cams. 

I reset both sides with the cam chain tensioning tool in place, this simulates the spring force on the tensioner plus the hydraulic force when the engine is running.

On replacing the tensioning tool with the original tensioner the go/no go gauge wouldn't fit. So the tensioning tool does make a difference.

I also checked the valve clearances at just over 3 hours since the engine was hot. They were all in spec. I'll check again in a couple of hours and report back on any changes.

I'm out on the bike tomorrow and I'll be interested to see how she runs. New plugs and air filter are being fitted as well as oils and filter.

Peter

Good to hear. Would have been nice to hear your impressions without the new plugs and air filter so that any improvement could be more directly attributed to the "improved' timing.

Boxflyer has not responded to my comment to his video yet. I suspect he is "low tech" .... now that you've borrowed all the tools, do you still need to buy his DIY tool?

I borrowed the tools from a friend and checked the cam timing on my '17 RS at around 45,000 miles and found them to be spot on. I am more than pleased. YMMV

Frank

(04-14-2023, 12:32 PM)Grumpy Goat Wrote: Good to hear. Would have been nice to hear your impressions without the new plugs and air filter so that any improvement could be more directly attributed to the "improved' timing.

Boxflyer has not responded to my comment to his video yet. I suspect he is "low tech" .... now that you've borrowed all the tools, do you still need to buy his DIY tool?

Probably not Wayne. It would have made me self sufficient but I don't need to do them again for some years I guess.

(04-14-2023, 02:46 PM)sanemancured Wrote: Probably not Wayne. It would have made me self sufficient but I don't need to do them again for some years I guess.

Ok. If he ever gets back to me I will reach out to you again to see if you changed your mind.

2 things, having checked my valve clearances at 3 1/2 hours from a hot engine and then 7, there was no change in clearances.

I've been out today. I don't believe that the new air filter and plugs would have made a discernible difference. Both the old plugs and air filter were far from being desperate for a change.

Initially the bike felt a little crisper. Later on, riding familiar roads at 60+ mph I found myself comfortably holding 3rd gear where before I'd have felt inclined to engage 4th. So it's smoother as the rev's rise of that I'm sure. I still get a familiar tingle through the seat though.

Thanks for the feedback - love it when people close the loop on a topic or thread.

You're probably right on the plugs and filter if they were essentially in good condition. That said, it sounds like the changes are quite subtle, and on an engine of this size and considering its [somewhat "agricultural"] character, small changes in timing from optimum are probably difficult to discern. Main thing is, you know that the timing is spot on and that peace of mind, as it were, is all that matters.